Poor Petey ... Update, he's gone and necropsy results :(

[Poppyseed]

Petey was being treated for a respiratory infection and he was doing so beautifully with the treatment. I was convinced he would completely turn around and be fine. He was running around and playing, he sounded great and he wasn't sneezy or lethargic at all.

Then yesterday that all changed. I saw him in his cuddle cup and thought he was so cute. He was doing so incredible I didn't think anything of it when he didn't move as I took pics. The lighting here is always darker so I didn't notice he was pale at the time... Then I went to give him meds later that night and noticed he wasn't even coherent... he was so listless. I picked him up and he was incredibly limp. I listened to his chest and could count his heart beat... It was bad.

I slept with him at night and drove to the vet in the morning. He seemed a bit better and actually munched a little on a lab block but wasn't 100%. He was still pale and tired and lethargic ): The vet said he sounded a little congested but that probably wasn't causing this. She did blood work and took x-rays and gave him fluids.

The blood work showed his sugar at 400... it's supposed to be 100 she told me. She still doesn't know what it is but told she could give him supportive care at her home and keep him on fluids. She would also do some more blood work and a urinalysis to try to find out why the sugar was off.

He was so lethargic. She gave me the choice of doing supportive care at home but I didn't want to risk it. It was so nice of her to take him home with her.

She also told me he would be better off staying at the E.R. for supportive care but it would be significantly more expensive. I couldn't afford that sadly enough ):

She didn't sound too hopeful and it breaks my heart. She said he might have a 50%-70% chance of surviving but she will have a more accurate figure when she knows more of what is going on.

She also will be hand feeding him for me.

Has anyone else had this happen to their rats? He also had a bit of trouble using his hind end but I don't think it was P.T. as it didn't look the same. It looked more like he didn't have the strength to coordinate his movement.

it was so sudden. Please pray he will be alright. Any insight would be appreciated. I've only had him for two months and he will be 2 in a month ): He was doing so well and I wanted to show him a good happy home for longer than I did.

[Poppyseed]

I am so upset over this as well. It hurts so much as I want so badly to have more time with him ): I really hope he pulls through and it hurts I can't be there by his side.

He was just with me such a short time and it could of been sooner if I would of stepped up and taken him from my aunt back in January. But I waited and I hate that I waited and he dealt with lice for longer. I feel like I just gave away that time I could of had with him ): I feel so guilty about that for some dumb reason. I just quit my job that was causing me so much stress and am back down to one and just the last few weeks I've had more time with him and was looking foreword to spending more time with him. It hurts so bad.

We slept together last night and he is so sweet. He always wants out and always gave kisses ): He never gave my aunt kisses but when I adopted him he gave so many.

I'm so hopeful he will turn around but can't shake this feeling that it could be the end ):

[Lise]

Just wondering.... was he/is he on steroids for the respiratory infection?? 

Steroids will cause increased blood sugar. (But of course your vet would know that, so I'm guessing that isn't the reason in this case...)

[scout]

You might find some tips in this article about diabetes:

http://www.rmca.org/Articles/diabetestype2.htm

[icicle]

I hope he pulls though for you

[Poppyseed]

It is a different vet then the one who prescribed the dexamethasone and I think she misheard me (or the misinterpreted the tech's writing or I mispoke) about that. She said it could be a cause. The levels just were incredibly high. She disagreed with the use of steroids in rats as it decreases their immune system. I hope that's not what got him ):

She called and said he is doing a little better but he's not "out of the woods yet". I'm glad he is doing better, it was good news. She's going to retest bloodwork and test the urine tomorrow. He's been on fluids and he even ate some mushed up lab blocks!

[Poppyseed]

They retested bloodwork and found something alarming. His red blood count was severely low, it was a little low yesterday but nothing alarming. Today it's severely low. The vet suspects a bleeding ulcer from the steroid. I'm so mad about that! I fear my other vet prescribed too high of a dose and I'm not going to him again. I know this one is more expensive but they are more knowledgeable and rat savy.

So I'm never useing steroids again unless prescribed by this certain vet and unless it's something they are going to die soon of anyway like P.T....

I'm so furious. I thought I was doing the right thing and I was killing my rat! He just got so much better right after the first dose and I should of listened to my instinct and discontinued right after the first one since he was 100% better. I did do the tapering ugh I'm so mad at myself.

So they could try blood clotting medication and supportive care the rest of the week but his chances are 10-20% even with that and that's $600-$1000 more... She said she could read up and see if a blood transfusion is possible but she said that would be extremely expensive. Yeah when she says things are expensive I know they are out of my reach. She didn't even know if it was possible to do in rats and she didn't know how he would react if favorably at all. And he still has that possible ulcer...


So I'm putting him to sleep today so he doesn't suffer any longer. He's more out of it. I'm going over there and bringing his cage mate and saying goodbye. I fear for the loneliness of his cagemate as he doesn't get along with other rats and needs neutered asap but I just spent $550 on Petey and I just spent $400 on Lugh's dental and extractions last week and even more than that on the vet visit for Morgan and Petey and the steroid that killed him ):

This mixture of guilt, madness, etc is more than I can take. And I'm alone today as my boyfriend is visiting his mother and grandmother. I only have $200 today but will be able to pay the rest of the bill tomorrow when Chris comes home.... they will have to deal with that promise.

[JR1030]

Oh, no...I'm so sorry.  You know we all do what we think is best, and it's logical to trust a vet.  I'm so sorry all this has happened...Petey doesn't blame you at all. 

[icicle]

Also sorry, I know it is a hard call to make.

[Poppyseed]

I'm back. We just put him down and I was so devestated I got severely lost getting there as I hadn't drove there from this address before and wasn't paying attention when Chris drove us down ): I ended up being over an hour late and couldn't call because I ran out of minutes then I went to get minutes and couldn't put in the right number so they shut off my service for my phone for the day and it was just a huge mess....


But I made it there right as the vet was going to leave. It was so good of her to come and do this on mothers day ): She said I made the right decision though and he really had a slim chance.

As I saw him he perked up and gave me a minute or so of perkiness where I saw his soul shine one more time. It's been a couple of days since I had seen that. I was afraid I was making the wrong decision but Dr. Edgly said he just perked up as he saw me and Dustin. Him and Dustin sniffed and Petey tried to get some grooming in but Dustin was too nervous to do that. Dustin is a very nervous rat. But they both laid their heads under my hand. He was still ghostly pale but his eyes shone for a little bit. Then they went out again after holding him and telling him I love him. After what seemed like all day petting and kissing and saying our goodbyes the vet put him under.

We decided to go forth with the necropsy so the other vet would know what was done. She did find ulcers and some intestine liner missing on the small intistine but no blood. But he had a great decrease in RBC count and his stool had been black and tarry. She also found he did have cardio myopothy so his chances of recover would of been decreased greatly by that even if we did opt for palative treatment.

The necropsy was good because it confirmed what was going on and that I made a right decision. It also shows that steroids are not without their side effect especially in rats. Granted Petey could of just had a severe reaction to the meds as I've seen that happen with dogs and steroids or anti-inflammatory meds as well.

But yeah, we will be burying him where we buried Odin. I'm very greatful for their care and will be seeing them for all my rats again.

[Dearpie]

I'm so sorry for your loss.  *HUGS*  I'm glad you had the necropsy done.  I'm REALLY glad you got to take Dustin in to see his brother, and you all got in some good quality time.  I hope your s heal quickly.

Which steroids was Petey given?  Was he also on metacam? I believe it's  metacam that can't be combined with pred, as it will cause internal bleeding/ulcers.

[Poppyseed]

Thank you Dearpie and every one else. He was not on metacam. He was on Dexamethasone and Baytril. The vet that did his treatment for the ulcer said it was on the high end of the dosage of dexamethasone but still within normal limits for what's in the books. She still disagreed with the usage of steroids in rats as they tend to lower immunity and increase blood sugar. His blood sugar was crazy high as well (400 when it was suppose to be 100) His RBC was 37% yesterday and 15% today

[Marybelle]

I'm so sorry for your loss.  *hugs*  I know that a necropsy after something like that does make me feel much better, as I at least have some sense of knowing what happened.  I hope you get the same peace.

I've only heard of Dex being given as injections, and then only generally in a single dose...  Did your vet give it orally?

[Poppyseed]

He did give it orally. Is that abnormal?

The necropsy did make me feel better, and I hope my other rat who was on dex will be alright. He seems okay but his poops are small. My Dr. Edgely didn't say anything about it being oral, she just says she never recommends it with rodents because of how it lowers there immune system and there are so many other drugs that work well with less side effects she likes to do first.

Dr. Edgely recommended I get an ulcer medication for Hobbes just in case from my other vet. She couldn't prescribe it as she hadn't seen Hobbes but she said she would talk my previous vet about it as he has. She also said she would send over the medical records if he wanted to see it. Previous vet and I are definitely having a talk about this later this week.

Also doing bloodwork and rads and everything really helped us get a good pin down on what exactly is going on. I know they are expensive but I am surprised more rat vets don't suggest or demand them more often as they are really important to finding specifics. Especially blood work. There was one rat being treated in there for hind end degeneration and it turned out he was having kidney problems, they did fluids and supportive care for that and he was doing much better without steroids. Much better than just throwing them at the rats assuming they have PT because obviously so many other things happen with age.

[Marybelle]

I've never heard of it given orally, but, according to the Ratguide article, it is given that way, as well.  In my experience with dogs and cats, when I worked at the vet, it was usually an injectable, since it seemed to work much faster, and you didn't have to worry about weaning them off it.  The Ratguide article does say it is for single or short-term use, but I don't know how long Petey was on it... 

I'm sorry you had to deal with all of this.  It's so hard to lose them to something like this, but don't blame yourself.  You trusted your vet, and there was no real way for your vet to know Petey would have this reaction.  Is it possible he had the ulcers prior to this infection, and the steroids just aggravated them?  It might be worth asking the vet about.