Hormonal or just likes to be in charge?

[nevadamoon]

I have a rat named Sam.  He's a wonderful rat with young rats- I call him the manny.  However, once they start getting to be the same size as him (I'd say he's around 6ish months old?  Don't even think that.  I'm an awful judge with ages.) he'll start bickering with them.  The only rat so far this hasn't happened with is the one he came to me with, (Not sure if they're brothers.)  who doesn't challenge him. 

I don't think it's hormone based, I think he just likes to be in charge.  Once they get to be close to his size, boxing starts, and it progresses from there.  He's only bitten another rat once, and I think it was purely accidental.  (And that rat was about his size, maybe a touch bigger, and didn't want to just automatically cave in, so they ended up in a tussle.)

Would it be better to get him neutered, or should I try getting a smaller cage for him to live alone with a few of my mellow rats?  It makes no sense to me to keep moving other rats out of his cage once they get too big for him, especially considering that I don't plan on adding to my groups anymore (Well, inevitably, probably a rat here and there.) and the males he's living with now are either almost to the size when problems start, or are the rat he's always lived with.

Advice on the best course of action?

[ilovemylittleangels]

Is it just boxing or do they draw blood? I'm no expert on rats but I've done a lot of research on them due to having two of my own. To me, it sounds as if they're establishing who's top rat - this is normal. The little ones have just grown big enough to be able to take him on.

I wouldn't consider removing him or neutering just yet, but keep an eye on them and if it seems to get too violent - ie drawing blood - I would towel the fighting rats so as not to get bitten and put them in separate cages.

As I said , I'm no expert but I hope this helps.

Good luck!!

[nevadamoon]

He has drawn blood on one rat, I just don't know how 'intentional' of a bite it was as he didn't lunge at the rat, but they were rolling around and it was getting pretty heated, and right after I noticed blood on the other rat.  Apart from that, it'll be boxing or just repeatedly pinning a rat down- and not playfully.

What worries me, I guess, is that this rat that he bit -while it was a rat he'd never met before- was not being dominating toward him.  The rat didn't just immediately roll over.  Right now, that rat has been introduced to a different group where he is fine, so it's not even an issue of reintroduction.  And Sam really is a GREAT rat.  So it's not a serious issue.  I just have to think ahead as to if I should invest in a separate cage now large enough to house him and the ones he does get along with (In case he starts fighting with my younger boys, some of which are about 2 weeksish away from that point.)  or if I should wait.  I really don't want to risk some of my other rats getting hurt, as he's not exactly a small boy.   

[ilovemylittleangels]

If you're really worried about it and Sam and the other rats seem to be happy with the way things are now, then it might be a good idea to leave him in with the boys he gets along with. It'll save bloodshed and put you at peace, so I say go for it!! Hope everything works out!

[nevadamoon]

Yes, but that's the whole issue.  He gets along with them now.  The oldest one is almost at that 4 month old point (I think, again, I'm awful with ages) and is now about half as large as Sam.  With the other boys that I had to move out of there (that he never bit, but who he was certainly getting heated with) they were just a bit bigger then what the guy is now.  He's a pretty laid back rat, but I'm just worrying if he gets much bigger, and Sam starts picking on him, and he doesn't want to take it, things could escalate.  The cage their in is rather large- large enough for 6-8 rats (I don't remember exactly, it has under 6 now.) and so I really don't have space in my other cages to transfer them.

[ilovemylittleangels]

Oh, I see. I've done a LOT of research on the topic and it sounds as if the boys are establishing their hierarchy. He probably doesn't fight with the rat he came with as they could have already established who was dominant before they came into your care. Seeing as all the other boys were smaller than Sam, he probably hasn't seen them as a challenge to his alpha rat status. As each rat reaches his size though, they will take each other on to establish alpha rat (or he will take them on to KEEP his status).
You say he's only bitten once and not intentionally? Was it deep? Did it bleed a lot, or just a little? Apparently if there are only minor wounds with the fighting there's no need to worry, it's just normal behaviour for rats. If it's anything serious though, like deep bites, gouges or a lot of bleeding, I would separate them, but I'm sorry to say I wouldn't know where to go from there.
There's a HEAP of info on fighting in the forum - just type "fighting" in the search bar and it'll come up with a heap of posts with questions similar to yours. Good luck!!