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Author Topic: ok the smell is killing me here  (Read 421 times)
petunia
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« on: July 04, 2009, 12:59:43 PM »

At first I thought I had nervous rats who were "fear pooping" those softer really smelly poops

but now ALL of my rats, even the really calm mellow ones have stinky poops- and I sleep in the same room with all the rats (two cages, one has 3 rats, the CN has 5 rats)

I am assuming now that this is somehow related to their diet.

I stopped feeding them beans (even though I never noticed beans making their droppings smelly, I figure with the bad rep beans have, may as well start there)

I stopped feeding veggies (broccoli, brussels sprouts, and peas) although I can't deprive them of peas for too long, they love those!!

For the last few days they have had primarily dog food (a mix of Solid Gold holistique blenz and Natural Balance reduced calorie dog food and NB all vegetarian dog food) OK so the vegetarian dog food has peas, potatoe protein, and lets see, some cranberries....but is mostly brown rice, oatmeal and barley

The NB reduced calorie has duck and chicken and  lamb meal, along with the rice and potatoes and carrots.

The Solid Gold has fish- well they've eaten oysters and never had a problem with those, so I'm thinking the fish isn't the problem.

They get the Sue Bee's mix, modified a bit, I leave out the puffed rice because no one ever ate it and there is rice in the dog food

I added Grape Nuts, maybe that's too much barley for them? and I put in shredded wheat along with the puffed wheat, and of course the Total cereal, plus oatmeal and cheerios

I do not add dried fruits, I am afraid that they will choke on them. (read somewhere that that is a danger)

They get the occasion bits of apple, and blueberries and watermelon but lately have not had any fruit, i was concerned that the fresh foods was causing the softer stools so stopped feeding them.

OK!! so out of that list of foods, what is the MOST likely culprit as far as causing the odor and wetness of their poops?

There is a chance that the poops are also being peed on, and have been otherwise normal til someone decided to pee on them, I don't know. They are very discreet when they "go" so I rarely see who did what, unless they've pooped or peed on me
Tongue

It's the odor that is killing me!! even my cats, who eat a very high protein diet don't have poop that smells this bad!!!!!! eeep
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evilhobbitgirl
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« Reply #1 on: July 04, 2009, 01:17:24 PM »

I've heard that broccoli can cause stinky poop and even gas so go give your boys some peas! Those are okay and have never made my manrats stinky.
If you've introduced anything new to them lately that might be the culprit? Or if you have given too many veggies. Maybe your boys just stink.  Tongue It took a month (maybe a little more?) after I got Dooley before his squishy stink poos stopped and he got used to his new diet.
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synelovator
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« Reply #2 on: July 04, 2009, 02:33:07 PM »

Cutting foods like that can also cause soft stool in animals, especially since it sounds like they were on a very yummy, supplemented diet before with all the fruits and veggies they were getting.  You might try adding some banana, a fruit that gums up stool.  It could also be something in the dog food, though I couldn't tell you what.

You just have to make all food changes gradual so the intestines can get used to the new diet.  Enzyme concentrations are changed based on what foods are given, and when you switch foods quickly the intestines aren't prepared to deal with that type of diet and smelly, undigested food comes out the other end, and/or bacteria go crazy in their gut causing gas and liquid stool.
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DolciLady
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« Reply #3 on: July 04, 2009, 03:07:43 PM »

give them canned pumpkin (not pumpkin pie mix).  make dietary changes very slowly or you'll just keep this process going as syn said.  maybe buy acidophilous powder to sprinkle in their food to help aid in digestion since they obviously aren't able to digest something properly.
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Ratlover101
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« Reply #4 on: July 04, 2009, 04:09:20 PM »

I would think that all the meat in their dog food is giving them smelling poops. Too much meat in their diet will give them smelling poops. I would cut out the dog food with the meats, meaning keep the NB veggie and maybe find another veggies brand dog food. High quality dog foods have a lot of meat in it which could be the culprit.
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JustJenna
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« Reply #5 on: July 04, 2009, 04:25:00 PM »

dittos here on the broccoli.  It makes for stinky poop!  I've never had a problem with peas, though, and peas are a staple around here since the boys and girls love them.  Bananas, too.  I've never tried canned pumpkin, although that sounds great!  I also give my rats a little yogurt sometimes, especially if they've had antibiotics.  They absolutely love it!  The yogurt did make my girls a little stinky the first few times they had it, though, but never after that.

I second what synelovator said - you have to make any diet changes gradually and intro new foods a little at a time.  Better for the ratties, but also if you only intro a little bit of new stuff at a time, you'll have a better idea of what things bother the rattie's tummies and also making them stinky.  As opposed to making many bigger changes at once.  Then you won't be able to tell which new thing it is, or if it's the quantity of new thing, or what.

I also second what Hobbitgirl said - every time I bring a new rattie home, it takes a few weeks before they stop smelling like the food they used to eat before they came to my house.  A stinky few weeks!    Tongue

ETA:  You can check the protein percentage on the dog food - someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I *think* if it's over 14%, it's too high for rats.  I tried a few brands before switching to Innova Senior, which is the least stinky and most enjoyed by my crew, although they get very little dog food and mostly Suebee's and fresh foods.  My dogs like the Innova, too.  Good luck!
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LifeInCircuit
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« Reply #6 on: July 04, 2009, 05:37:58 PM »

I would think that all the meat in their dog food is giving them smelling poops. Too much meat in their diet will give them smelling poops. I would cut out the dog food with the meats, meaning keep the NB veggie and maybe find another veggies brand dog food. High quality dog foods have a lot of meat in it which could be the culprit.

The others are usually soy based, and soy makes awful smelling poops too(I have two vegan human children, I'm well acquainted with soy poos! lol).
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Ratlover101
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« Reply #7 on: July 04, 2009, 06:23:12 PM »

Thats true about the soy. I forgot about that. Then I would try switching to another food with less meat. The NB foods usually have some kind of meat as the first 2 or 3 ingredients which is a lot of meat. So try something like Blue Buffalo LITE which has chicken and then I think barley as the second ingredient. Less meat.
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melikerats
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« Reply #8 on: July 04, 2009, 07:22:25 PM »

don't rats need some fresh fruits and veggies in their diet? I know they can live off just the dog food but it would be healthier for them to get at least some veggies once a week or something (thats usually what i do with my rats)

but yeah i think its probably the veggies that are making their poop gross, some times my boys have really gross ones but i've never noticed that it was from a particular type of food... so i guess i can't help ya
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Ratlover101
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« Reply #9 on: July 04, 2009, 09:05:24 PM »

Yes, rats need veggies in their diet and should be given either everyday or every other day.
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CaitlynRae
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« Reply #10 on: July 04, 2009, 09:18:57 PM »

Yes, rats need veggies in their diet and should be given either everyday or every other day.

Yep yep. Everyday is best, but atleast everyother day. Would you want to survive off of blocks that taste like cardboard your whole life? Then don't make you're rats Grin


ETA:  You can check the protein percentage on the dog food - someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I *think* if it's over 14%, it's too high for rats.  I tried a few brands before switching to Innova Senior, which is the least stinky and most enjoyed by my crew, although they get very little dog food and mostly Suebee's and fresh foods.  My dogs like the Innova, too.  Good luck!


Yeppers. Just like humans, rats need a mostly carb based diet. 14% is best, but under 16% is okay too. Besides causing smelly poo, too high of protien raises the pH of their urine, which isn't good for their little kidneys. Too high of protien, in rats, humans and other animals that require a mostly carb based diet, can lead to kidney failure later in life  Undecided

Lower the protien of their diet and give your ratties back their veggies!  Grin
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petunia
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« Reply #11 on: July 05, 2009, 11:53:53 AM »

ok I checked out some of the dog foods mentioned, and here is what I found:
This is what is in Innova Senior dog food
Ingredients:
Turkey, Chicken, Barley, Brown Rice, Potatoes, Rice, Pea Fiber, Chicken Meal, Herring, Flaxseed, Chicken Fat, Natural Flavors, Apples, Carrots, Herring Oil, Egg, Sunflower Oil, Potassium Chloride, Dicalcium Phosphate, Cottage Cheese, Alfalfa Sprouts, Pumpkin, Dried Chicory Root, Glucosamine Hydrochloride, Chondroitin Sulfate, Direct-Fed Microbials, Lecithin, Rosemary Extract, Vitamins/Minerals 
 
Guaranteed Analysis %:
Crude Protein (min)  18  
Moisture (max)  10 
Crude Fat (min)  8 
Crude Fiber (max)  5.5 
 
This is what is in Natural balance reduced calorie dog food:
 
Ingredients:
Brown Rice, Chicken, Duck Meal, Lamb Meal, Oatmeal, Barley, Potatoes, Carrots, Potato Fiber, Chicken Meal, Chicken Fat (preserved with natural mixed tocopherols), Natural Flavor, Brewers Yeast, Salmon Meal, Salmon Oil, Whole Ground Flaxseed, Potassium Chloride, Choline Chloride, Taurine, Spinach, Parsley Flakes, Cranberry, Lysine, L-Carnitine, Yucca, Kelp, Vitamin E Supplement, Iron Proteinate, Zinc Proteinate, Copper Proteinate, Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Potassium Iodide, Thiamine Mononitrate (Vitamin B-1), Manganese Proteinate, Manganous Oxide, Ascorbic Acid, Vitamin A Supplement, Biotin, d-Calcium Pantothenate, Manganese Sulfate, Sodium Selenite, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B-6), Vitamin B-12 Supplement, Riboflavin (Vitamin B-2), Vitamin D-3 Supplement, Folic Acid (Vitamin B). 
 
Guaranteed Analysis %:
Crude Protein (minimum)  16.5 
Moisture (maximum)  10 
Crude Fat (minimum)  6 
Crude Fiber (maximum)  5 
Omega-6 Fatty Acids (minimum)  1.7 
Omega-3 Fatty Acids (minimum)  0.3 
 

This is what is in the NB Vegetarian food:


Ingredients:
Ground Brown Rice, Oatmeal, Pearled Barley, Potato Protein, Canola Oil, Carrots, Dicalcium Phosphate, Calcium Carbonate, Peas, Natural Vegetable Flavor, Tomato Pomace, Flaxseed Meal, Rosemary Extract, Choline Chloride, Potassium Chloride, Parsley Flakes, Dried Kelp, Sodium Chloride, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Lecithin, Yeast Culture, Garlic Powder, Lactobacillus acidophilus, Zinc Proteinate, Ferrous Sulfate, vitamin E Supplement, vitamin B-12 Supplement, Ascorbic Acid (vitamin C), Taurine, L-Lysine, Manganese Sulfate, Niacin, Riboflavin (vitamin B-2), Copper Proteinate, Grapeseed Oil, Copper Sulfate, d-Calcium Pantothenate, vitamin A Acetate, Inositol, Folic Acid, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (vitamin B-6), Thiamin Mononitrate (vitamin B-1), vitamin D-2, Biotin, Ethylenediamine Dihydriodide (source of Iodine), Cobalt Sulfate, Menadione Sodium Bisulfate Complex (source of vitamin K activity), Sodium Selenite. 
 
Guaranteed Analysis %:
Protein (minimum)  18 
Moisture (maximum)  10 
Fat (minimum)  8 
Fiber (maximun)  4 
 
OK how's that for weird, NO MEAT but more protein than the NB reduced calorie with meat!!

The Solid Gold Holistique blendz has fish as the fourth ingredient and has as much protein as the NB vegetarian:
 
Ingredients:
Oatmeal, Cracked Pearled Barley, Millet, Ocean Fish, Potatoes, Canola Oil, Tomato Pomace, Flaxseed, Natural Flavor, Salmon Oil (source of DHA), Choline Chloride, Taurine, Dried Chicory Root, Amaranth, Parsley Flakes, Spearmint, Almond Oil, Sesame Oil, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Kelp, Thyme, Blueberries, Cranberries, Apples, Lentils, Quinoa, Vitamin E Supplement, Iron Proteinate, Zinc Proteinate, Copper Proteinate, Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Potassium Iodide, Thiamine Mononitrate, Manganese Proteinate, Manganous Oxide, Ascorbic Acid, Vitamin A Supplement, Biotin, Calcium Panthothenate, Manganese Sulfate, Sodium Selenite, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Riboflavin, Vitamin D Supplement, Folic Acid 
 
Guaranteed Analysis %:
Protein  18 
Moisture  10 
Fat  6 
Fiber  4 
 
I think Ill go back to the Regal Rat food:
Ingredients:
Whole Brown Rice, Oat Groats, Wheat Bran, Wheat, Soybean Meal, Menhaden Fish Meal, Soybean Hulls, Monocalcium Phosphate, Flax Seed Meal, (Linseed), Brewers Yeast, Calcium Carbonate, Wheat Germ Meal, Methionine DL, Salt, Yeast Culture (Saccharomyces cerevisiae), Vitamin A Acetate, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Vitamin E Supplement (topopherol), Vitamin C Supplement (Asorbic Acid), Colloidal Silica, Riboflavin, Niacin Supplement, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex (Vitamin K), Pantothenic Acid, Biotin, Thiamine, Choline Chloride, DL-Methionine, Pyrodoxine Hydrochloride, Folic Acid, Sodium Selenite, Magnesium Sulfate, Ferrous Sulfate, Cobalt Carbonate, Manganese Oxide, Zinc Oxide, Zinc Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Mineral Oil, Calcium Iodate, Potassium Chloride, Natural Flavorings 
 
Guaranteed Analysis %:
Crude Protein min  14 
Moisture (max)  10 
Crude Fiber max  7.5 
Crude Fat min  4 
Calcium max  1.2 
Calcium (min)  0.75 
Phosphorus (min)  0.65 
 
They weren't thrilled with it but they WOULD eat it.

As far as what percentage of Sue Bees to feed, I think I read that the lab blocks or dog food is supposed to make up 80% of their diet and the SUe Bees and fresh foods the other 20%, let me see if I can find that link....

Anyway, thanks for your input, I do have acidophilus (SP?)and I put some on their food and the poops are a lot less stinky (after two days, not immediately) so I think I'll give them some of that once a week or so or anytime they start to get stinky again!!

I've got 7 girls and one boy. The boy has the largest poops but he's not the stinkiest one LOL
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binkyhoo
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Dance with rats



« Reply #12 on: July 05, 2009, 03:35:33 PM »

Wow! to the post above me for keybording all that. I wish I could. Ratty Smiley
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Ratlover101
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« Reply #13 on: July 05, 2009, 03:38:21 PM »

LOL I think she copied and pasted most of it  Tongue
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binkyhoo
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Dance with rats



« Reply #14 on: July 05, 2009, 04:43:28 PM »

LOL I think she copied and pasted most of it  Tongue

I bet your right. I am slow on the comp skilz.   Hyper  Just dont call the net  cops on me  police
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petunia
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« Reply #15 on: July 05, 2009, 05:47:02 PM »

LOL I think she copied and pasted most of it  Tongue

I bet your right. I am slow on the comp skilz.   Hyper  Just dont call the net  cops on me  police

 Yellow Cute Laugh

oh yeh copy and paste is my friend 
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