I agree w/ Jen... I have "rescues" on my site, some of which are "reserved" until I am clear of quarantine, then they can go home.  None of those rats require an adoption fee, so adopters aren't "paying for" a rat, nor are they paying for it to be reserved, however, donations to our local club are encouraged.

With rats that I have bred, I often place them as "available" before they are weaned.  Rats are "reserved" until they are ready to go home.. I don't see that necessarily as referring to a possession.  Now, if I placed a big old "sold" next to that rat, then sure, that's a little impersonal and does seem more like an "object" than a life....

So basically we're going to take one thing and call it something else so we feel better about it.  It's not for sale, it's an adoption fee.  You aren't buying it, you're rescuing it.  Bottom line, you pay for a rat, you're buying it.  You can fill out all the forms you want but money is still being exchanged for a life.

So when you adopt a dog from your favorite rescue group, and pay an "adoption fee" in the range of $75-150, are you "buying" a dog?

And I'm with Lenore, money is exchanged ALL the time in human adoptions, miscelanious fees, lawyers, court fees, etc... is that "purchasing" a child?

I also want to add, that "purchasing" something implies profit... I've yet to see any rescuers or breeders make a profit.... I know I don't, and even with my business (the rat store) I just *barely* manage to stay ahead and not lose money... and that is completely seperate from my own rattery.  My rattery loses money, lots of money, and I could easily charge twice what I do and still lose money.. and it's not by managing money poorly.. I promise you that!

When something is sold, there's a profit involved. I would just as well not charge an adoption fee, like I said it's such a minimal amount it makes no difference to me if I get it or not. I do it to discourage the rats being adopted out to the wrong sorts of people, not to make money. So if that means I'm "selling" these rescue rats, well so be it then.

We've talked about this before, but if I follow this logic that would mean that my fosters are not rescues since they're in no immediate danger and life threatening situation and are cared for well...

LOL never mind. I didn't mean to sound so curt and irritated when I posted that, I was writing a quick reply during my lunch break and I guess I was more tired than I thought

Ziggy, we've already discussed this, so we both know how we feel about this issue and obviously we don't see eye to eye. Let's just agree to disagree and call it a truce?

Here's the thing. If I get a dog from a breeder, I feel as though I am purchasing it. If I don't someone else will and that breeder IS making a profit. So if a dog breeder advertises Pure breed lab puppies available for adoption, I'm gonna be pissed! Because in reality they are for sale. They will not be PTS if no one buys them, they don't get euthanized after 2 weeks and the breeder certainly isn't a non profit organization.
So I say, breeders SELL animals.
Now, given we are talkign about rats, it's a little different in that the breeder doesn't make a profit BUT the ratlings are not PTS if no one buys them, there is no set time period that they must be bought and the rat breeder isn't a non profit organization. Therefor, the rat is a purchase.

And since we are talking about fees. The non profit organization fees don't even cover the money that the organization puts into the animals, they lose money with every adoption.  Same goes for the rat breeder but they choose to breed the rats and lose the money.

In conclusion, I really get offended when I see a breeder offering an animal for adoption. I think it's very misleading and an insult to rescues and shelters.

But I like all of you out there even those who breed so don't take this too personal.

I think it's pretty safe to say that there are a few views on this topic, and they are not likely to gel into full agreement between anyone...