Author Topic: Was Underweight Basset - Now Incontinence Issues  (Read 3113 times)

Offline ZooKeeper83

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Was Underweight Basset - Now Incontinence Issues
« on: March 22, 2008, 05:09:56 PM »
Ok.  I'll try to sum up my situation as quickly as possible.  I have a 7 year old basset hound - typical inbred basset - horrible allergies, shoulder and hip dysplasia, multiple tumors (some removed and some still there - none that have been diagnosed as cancer yet), and bad arthritis.  When he was younger, I 'indulged' his eating a little too much and he was up to 65 pounds.  We put him on a strict diet for his weight and allergies and he went down to a healthy 40-45 pounds for the past 3-4 years.

Two months ago, he started peeing constantly.  I took him to the vet and he had a bladder infection AND was now only weighing in at 31.5 pounds.  That floored me.  He had been looking skinnier to me and I had recently upped his Canidae to 2 cups a day rather than the normal 1 1/2 cups, but I figured it was all in my mind.  His ribs are easily visible and you can now see his hip bones.  My vet said his current diet was good, so we took fecal and blood samples.  Everything showed him to be completely normal, so we agreed that I would just up his diet to 3 cups a day to try and help him gain weight.

Just a bit ago, he started peeing more again and wanting a lot more water than normal.  He has been kennel trained since he was a puppy, and now can rarely make it through the day without peeing in the kennel.  Worried that he had another bladder infection, I took in 2 more urine samples and both came back completely normal.  My vet is no longer sure what's wrong with him.  The next step would be more blood work and x-rays.   

That will definitely be my next step, BUT I realized I had been upping his DRY dog food (which gets water in it) and thought that might be making him thirstier each day.  So I started him on a mixture of dry food and wet food about 3 days ago to see if that helps even him out while I try to also fatten him up.

I guess my overall questions are - Does anyone have any other ideas for helping him gain weight while not making him crave more water?  And does my idea that it might be the extra dry food causing all this seem plausible?  Or am I just hopeful that it's the answer because it's the easy one?

Oh, and raw diet can't be given daily yet, but hopefully I'll be able to switch over in the next few months after I move into my new house.

Thanks!
Melissa

« Last Edit: April 06, 2008, 05:09:49 PM by ZooKeeper83 »
Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline tsk_n_such

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Re: Underweight Basset Hound
« Reply #1 on: March 22, 2008, 06:41:20 PM »
I'd start with a full blood panel. Perhaps a send out basic that includes a thyroid test (dogs usually get hypothyroidism, which tend to make dogs chubby, but sometimes there is that weird dog who has to do the opposite). Diabetes can increase thirst and cause weight loss, but chances are there would be an indication of that when the urine was analyzed.  You might also talk to your vet about testing for Cushing's Disease, which can increase thirst (and thus urination)

In the meantime, you could try supplementing half, or more, of the meal with a canned version of the food. Canned includes a lot of water, so many dogs don't drink as much. 
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Offline ZooKeeper83

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Re: Underweight Basset Hound
« Reply #2 on: March 22, 2008, 07:35:16 PM »
Well, I know his thyroid checked out ok in the last blood work.  We'll probably end up checking everything again, though, this time around.  We definitely didn't talk about Cushing's Disease, so I'll bring that up when I'm in the office for the blood work.  I just looked it up, and it might be a possibility with him.

Thanks!
Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline Lmbswimmer

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Re: Underweight Basset Hound
« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2008, 07:14:16 AM »
I would also be double checking his blood sugars, and maybe even kidney function testing at this point too depending on the sugar test. 

Offline Heather

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Re: Underweight Basset Hound
« Reply #4 on: March 23, 2008, 11:48:55 PM »
It makes sense to me because raw meats are 70-80% moisture and dry food is only 10%. That's quite a gap. It takes quite a bit of drinking toclose that gap, and therefore more urine. I'm no expert by any means though. Could he have diabetes?

Offline ZooKeeper83

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Re: Underweight Basset Hound
« Reply #5 on: March 29, 2008, 01:14:22 PM »
I just thought I'd update about happened and see if anyone has any other ideas.  I made Dopey (my basset boy) an appointment with his vet for this morning.  I was very glad I did, because last night an hour after he ate his dinner, he threw it back up again.  The rest of the night he was lethargic, his stomach was grumbling constantly, he was burping horrible smelling gas, and he needed to go out every few hours.   He was still wanting water, though, so I let him have little bits at a time.  At 5am, he asked to go out and I saw he was defecating, but having a hard time of it.  When it was light out, I went to check to see what it looked like and saw that it was loose with a small tinge of blood in it.

We got to the vet's office around 8:30, and he threw up a little water and dog food as soon as we got in the building.   Then, while waiting for the doctor to come in the room, he emptied the rest of the water out of his stomach.  (I felt so bad for the kennel staff  :-\)

He also now weighed in at only 33.8 lbs.  It's at least a little bit up from the last 31.5 lbs, but it just doesn't seem like a lot to me when he was getting twice the amount of food for over 2 months.

We had full blood work taken and sub-q pepsid and fluids given since he was now dehydrated from all the vomiting.  She sent me home with flagyl and more sub-q fluids to give him over the rest of the weekend so he wouldn't have to stay there overnight.  I've given fluids and shots before as a zookeeper, but any suggestions on how fast the drip should be for a 33 pound dog?  I'm use to syringing it straight under the skin and the last animal I did that to was a ferret, so there's a bit of a size difference there.

She just called back and the blood work was all completely normal, except for showing the obvious dehydration.  We have an ultrasound set up for later this week.  She's now worried that it might be cancer, but she said the ultrasound would also show if it is Cushing's..

The vomiting could very well be a bad reaction to the wet dog food.  I was trying to slowly work it in by adding another 1/4 of a can every 4-5 days, but maybe that was still too fast for him.

Now I'm definitely getting worried about my baby.  :-\
Thanks for any input.
~Melissa
Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline Lise

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Re: Underweight Basset Hound
« Reply #6 on: March 29, 2008, 03:32:43 PM »
You can run in subq fluids as fast as they will go in.  If you are running it out of a bag you can even squeeze the bag to make it go in faster.   :)  And just switch spots if you need to give more fluids and the skin is getting tight around one area (which probably won't even be a problem in a basset).

I'm sorry to hear he isn't doing any better.  :(  Hang in there Dopey!  And get better.  :heart:

|| Lise ||

The Boy: Simon  The Girls: Arizona | Karma | Pepper | Penelope 

& Always Remembered: Molly, Nora, Tevy, Lucy, Guinness, Seagram, Pixie, Cleopatra, Skye, Bella, Juno, Sasha, Gibson

Offline ZooKeeper83

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Re: Underweight Basset Hound *Vet Update*
« Reply #7 on: March 29, 2008, 05:18:46 PM »
Thanks!  Haha, yeah, I figured it'd be pretty easy getting the fluids in with all his extra skin hanging around.  That's why I opted to just do it myself rather than pay for him to stay there over night just so they could do it.  I wouldn't have even wanted to see that addition to the bill.  :eek:

I have one more question for today.  They gave him their injection of fluids around 9:30 this morning and he still has a large bubble of saline hanging on the side of his chest (it fell there only minutes after they injected it between his shoulder blades) 7 1/2 hours later.  Is that normal?  It feels like there's about a cup of fluid just hanging there.   Heh, it looks a little funny, too, since it's literally just hanging there in a fold of loose skin.  I tried to call back the vet's office to ask, but I forgot it's a Saturday so they close earlier.   I just don't want to end up injecting more if it's really not needed and it's already not absorbing properly.

Thanks!  And Dopey says thanks too!  :D
Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline Lise

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Re: Underweight Basset Hound *Vet Update*
« Reply #8 on: March 29, 2008, 06:42:23 PM »
I would not give any more fluids, if the fluids he has already been given haven't completely absorbed.

It is normal for them to run down there after being administered, but if the animal is dehydrated and needs the fluid they should be absorbed by the body within a few hours usually.    The fact that they are not all absorbed means he probably didn't need that much hydration, and I wouldn't add in more.

I would also contact the vet tomorrow (if you can??) to ask about adjusting the amount to be given.
|| Lise ||

The Boy: Simon  The Girls: Arizona | Karma | Pepper | Penelope 

& Always Remembered: Molly, Nora, Tevy, Lucy, Guinness, Seagram, Pixie, Cleopatra, Skye, Bella, Juno, Sasha, Gibson

Offline ZooKeeper83

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Re: Underweight Basset Hound *Vet Update*
« Reply #9 on: April 03, 2008, 07:25:47 PM »
And we're back from yet another expensive vet visit.  Even my vet likes to call Dopey my problem child now.  :yelcutelaugh:  He had the ultrasound today and he showed everything was normal inside except his intestines.  The intestine lining was very thick along the whole intestine and had spotting on it.  She thinks he has irritable bowel disease, which would completely explain the weight loss.  It does fit, too.  He occasionally gets diarrhea, but he also likes to eat random normally inedible objects that he finds (tissues, pens, makeup, etc).  So I always blamed it on that, since it would come and go.   :doh:  She's doing one more blood test to make sure and then we're going to put him on steroids and medication for it.

However, it still doesn't explain the incontinence.  She's now wondering if it's psychological.  I just don't know what would be causing that now.  And if it is just psychological, what can I even do?  I can't have him peeing on himself in his kennel and on the floors every single day.  I've tried limiting his water, but I really don't like the idea of doing that.  I don't want to risk him becoming dehydrated either.  We're running out if ideas here...

~Melissa
Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline ZooKeeper83

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Re: Underweight Basset Hound *Yet Another Vet Update*
« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2008, 05:08:17 PM »
I have to ask again if there are any other ideas on what to do for Dopey's peeing.  Today for example,  he has had a total of 48 oz of water.  I give him 16 oz at a time every time he is thirsty and he normally drinks it all without stopping.  For about 5 hours straight now, I have had to let him go pee every 15 minutes or so.  And he pees a decent amount each time!   He acts like they're each emergencies, too.  It's becoming exhausting for both of us, I'm sure.  It's as if he can't hold any in for any length of time anymore.  Yet, everything has shown him to be completely healthy (bladder-wise).  This can't be normal, can it?

~Melissa
Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline Lmbswimmer

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Re: Was Underweight Basset - Now Incontinence Issues
« Reply #11 on: April 06, 2008, 07:16:41 PM »
I would check him for diabetes.  Even if he tests negative for it on a blood test at the vets ask if you can do home testing before/after eating etc... I believe a human grade test kit should work, and I believe that dogs blood sugar level should be around that of a humans.  But definitely double check with your vet on that.  I know that a late sign of diabetes is excessive thirst/peeing.

Offline E!!

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Re: Was Underweight Basset - Now Incontinence Issues
« Reply #12 on: April 07, 2008, 10:10:10 AM »
I have no ideas about what may be the problem, but in the meantime to make things easier on yourself have you thought of getting him a diaper? My sister had a dog who constanly marked inside the house and she got him this things that went arond his belly and "boy part." It made a big difference for her.