Author Topic: Seperation Anxiety  (Read 4228 times)

Offline ~Lin

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Seperation Anxiety
« on: May 24, 2006, 10:16:29 PM »
So Tessa chews and tears up any crate pad/bed I put in her crate. This drives absolutely nuts, because I want her to be more comfortable in her crate but she destroys them. I put a new one in tonight, and ran to the video store. I was gone for 30 minutes, and it was a massacre. Pictures follow:





So, help! What can I do? She got so much better about her seperation anxiety, and wasnt tearing up her crate pads for a while. But then I switched jobs, and spend more time at home. So she wants to be with me, ALL the time. And she can't stand it when I'm gone, and I'm gone so irregularly (different days, different times, different lengths of times) that its hard to work with her on this. And doing the crate training with extending periods while I'm home doesnt work, she knows when I go outside. I don't know how exactly, but she knows. I can keep her in her crate overnight, for 8 hours and as long as I'm in the house she is fine. But I leave for 30 minutes? You saw the pics...
« Last Edit: May 25, 2006, 03:29:28 PM by Lin171 »

Offline trubandloki

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2006, 06:40:01 AM »
Personally I would start by not giving her a bed to destroy.

Offline ~Lin

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #2 on: May 25, 2006, 07:09:49 AM »
^^Oh wow, your a genius. Cause I never would have thought of that!  :doh:

Just preventing her from doing damage doesnt stop that she is in fact stressing when I'm not home. And stress can cause more problems than just tearing up a crate bed. Id rather have a permanent long term solution, than a quick fix.

Offline trubandloki

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #3 on: May 25, 2006, 07:56:04 AM »
I mentioned it because you seemed to keep giving her bedding to destroy....

Sorry if it was obvious.


Make comings and goings non-events.  In other words, when you come  home act like you have been there all along, don't do the welcome home dog dance.  When you leave act like it is nothing too.

Make sure you are the dominant member of your relationship.  Many dogs with seperation anxiety have it because they are worried about where the other pack members are all day.  They feel it is their job to keep them together and protected and you are not anywhere they can find you so they stress. 

Do you give her anything in her cage to keep her busy?  A kong or such.

Offline ~Lin

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #4 on: May 25, 2006, 08:04:35 AM »
Ive never made a big deal about comings and goings. In fact, if she gets excited shes not allowed out of her crate/out the door etc until she is sitting calmly waiting (which is only an issue if shes been in her crate 8 hours, then she will wait calmly for me to open the crate door but rocket to the back door to go pee. So I make her sit calmly at the back door for a second before I let her out to pee).

I am definately the dominant member in our relationship. All I have to do is give her a look or tone of voice and she knows shes in trouble. Makes me feel guilty for yelling at her, but at least she understands when she did wrong.

I give her an everlasting treat ball when I leave. Its a treat she ONLY gets in her crate, and ONLY when I'm leaving the house. Its a rubber ball with 2 everlasting treats on either side and stuffed with dog biscuits for when she actualy gets through the everlasting treat part.

Offline knuckles

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2006, 08:19:21 AM »
http://www.clickersolutions.com/articles/2002/sa.htm

I'll be honest I'm a bit confused.  you orginal post seemed to be asked about how to keep her from destroying the crate pad, so I'm with trub....don't give her one to destroy.  not so much at needing help with the separation anxiety.

good luck with it

Offline trubandloki

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #6 on: May 25, 2006, 08:29:32 AM »

I am definately the dominant member in our relationship. All I have to do is give her a look or tone of voice and she knows shes in trouble. Makes me feel guilty for yelling at her, but at least she understands when she did wrong.



There is a difference between being the dominant member of the relationship and your dog being afraid of you.
With the description you give it sounds more like your dog is confused about who is in charge so when you act like you are in charge she gets scared because she doesn't know what to do.

Offline ~Lin

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2006, 08:33:09 AM »
Sorry, I thought I was clear that I was asking for help about the seperation anxiety... The tearing up the crate pads is only a symptom of the problem. I reread my original post, and I still think its obvious the problem is seperation anxiety, so I don't know anything I could change to make it more clear. Also signs of anxiety are her drooling and shedding a ton when I'm gone. I'm looking at the link knuckles, most of it looks like stuff Ive tried or stuff that I cant do  like videotaping, retraining with increased intervals away (I cant do that because I'm busy working, and plus I did that once when I had time and we are still back at the beginning again anyway).

And my dog is NOT scared of me. I'm not stupid, I know what dominance means. I have the dog, 2 cats, and 2 horses. She doesnt get scared, she gets shameful. She knows when she has done wrong, and looks at me guiltily. She even does it before I get mad. Sometimes I will leave, and when I open the door shes standing there with her guilty face on. So then I have to search the house to find out what she did that she knows she shouldnt.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2006, 08:35:01 AM by Lin171 »

Offline trubandloki

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2006, 08:52:16 AM »
Dogs do not really do guilt, but .....


Well then, I suggest you ask your vet for the name of a good dog behaviorist and go from there.

Offline kim

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #9 on: May 25, 2006, 09:17:24 AM »
shredding a bed isnt SA to me - my dog shreds beds simply because he is bored and destructive. there is hair everywhere because when he turns around, he rubs on the crate.

SA dogs are uncontainable - they hurt themselves, they chew their way out of crates. They destroy the house, they make their mouths bleed from chewing. They bark nonstop.

You can't diagnosis this or help it over the internet - find a good behaviorist and go from there. I have my doubts that this is SA, but thats for a professional who can see the dog and examine it, to decide.

For the record, Rah doesn't get anythign in his crate while I am gone because I don't want him eating his bedding. He has beds at night, and while I am home. But when I leave, he just sleeps on the bottom of the crate.
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Offline Dearpie

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #10 on: May 25, 2006, 10:48:03 AM »
Agreed.  It's simple.  Don't give her the bedding to destroy.  There's nothing wrong with the dog sleeping on the bottom of the crate.  Dogs willing lay down on hard floors, and porches.  It's a behavior, not SA.

Quote
^^Oh wow, your a genius. Cause I never would have thought of that! 

In the future, when you ask for advice, it's not acceptable to retort in such a smartass manner.  If you don't want hear logical solutions, don't ask.  Simple.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2006, 10:54:56 AM by Dearpie »

Offline E!!

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2006, 02:58:05 PM »
First of all I have to say WOW, reading this subject, you guys got ugly with each other quick...

For my 2 cents worth... My bf dog does similiar things to blankets, and she is one of the calmest crate dogs I have ever seen, but for her chewing off the end of a blanket and pulling out the stuffing a piece at a time is great fun (she would rather keep her self entertained with that than any chew toy) He had to start buying her stuffingless toys, casue that was the first thing she would do- pull the stuffing out.

I too have a dog that goes beserk in the crate. The thing is, she only seems to do it when she knows someone is around. If you try to put her in the crate while you home (mopping, having the door open for a while) she just can't stand it! This little dog with throw such a fit that the crate will literally be turn 180 degrees and be a few feet from where it started. However if no one is around she will sleep or chew her toys calmly in her crate... So maybe you are only seeing the way she reacts when she knows you are nearby. If she isn't hurting herself she may actaully be calm while you are away. If you have a friend with a video camera it might be worth checking out.

Now I have a general questions myself... apparently one of the methods for training was to leave at longer and longer intervals.. I was under the impression that dogs really don't have a sense of time, so that comment confused me. It certainly seems to be true, cause my puppy greats me the same after 10 mins as she does when its been 4 hours... does anyone know more about this?

Offline ~Lin

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #12 on: May 25, 2006, 03:27:40 PM »
I'm sorry for my first smartass response, but I thought the post above mine was smartass. I didn't understand how someone read the post wrong, I was just using the tearing up pads/crates as one of her symptoms of SA. And, I still don't understand why people are still saying the solution is remove bedding when I explained the real problem is the SA that I want to stop, not the tearing bedding. The first part of my title was Seperation Anxiety, I will go ahead and delete the rest of the title to hopefully make it more clear. She whines the entire time Ive gone. People have heard it outside. When theres no bed in her crate, I return to her fur wet and the bottom of the crate covered in drool from panting. There will be clumps of fur in the crate, along with enough fur raked off the carpet with my hands to cover a small cat. All of these are symptoms of SA. But you want something more? Something more definitive that the problem is SA? Hows this, when I didnt crate her she jumped through a window. It was in my old apartment, and somone had replaced the window more cheaply with plexiglass in the past. Thank god, I don't know what would have happened if it had been glass. It was a window that was the top half of the first kitchen door leading into a mud room with a solid wood door. So she still couldnt get out all the way to follow me, but she tried. If that window had been glass, I may have come home to a shredded bloody mess.

Offline Dearpie

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Re: Seperation Anxiety
« Reply #13 on: May 25, 2006, 03:37:59 PM »
I'd look into giving her some Bach's Flower Rescue Remedy, mimulus, or one of the others for calming.

Offline trubandloki

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #14 on: May 25, 2006, 04:12:21 PM »
I'm sorry for my first smartass response, but I thought the post above mine was smartass.

Um.... well that is where you were wrong!  Sorry, I thought I was answering the question honestly. 

If was being sarcastic (which I was not, not even close) I would have placed a smiley of some sort to show that.  Don't just assume someone is being sarcastic and maybe you will not feel the need to be defensive.

I ready your post that the issue was shredding her bedding due to her seperation anxiety and you wanted to know how to deal with it.

Offline ~Lin

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Re: Seperation Anxiety
« Reply #15 on: May 25, 2006, 04:25:43 PM »
I am sorry for the misunderstanding. Its hard on the internet, when you dont have tone or inflection. And what means something to one person, doesnt mean the same to another. Which is apparant here, because when I read my original post I still see seperation anxiety as the issue, with tearing the bedding my example!

Offline trubandloki

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Re: Seperation Anxiety
« Reply #16 on: May 26, 2006, 06:23:04 AM »
I am sorry for the misunderstanding. Its hard on the internet, when you dont have tone or inflection. And what means something to one person, doesnt mean the same to another.

That is exactly why, instead of jumping up and down and assuming people are being sarcastic when you read something, assume they are not being sarcastic and take things at face value.

Offline Dahlas

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Re: Seperation Anxiety
« Reply #17 on: May 26, 2006, 06:45:23 AM »
There are many thing that I would do like putting the dog in the crate off and on all day while I was home. Going out side with the dog in the crate for different periods of time. Giving the dog praise for being good and quiet and scolding for any whining,chewing, barking.....
The crate needs to be some place that is not a big deal not ...oh my she is leaving me again.Even putting the crate in a different room like the bathroom,bedroom...  so that when you are putting her in it off and on all day long she doesn't see you. She needs to slowly learn to be by herself quietly. I would go in and give her treats at different intervals. Letting her out at different intervals only when she is quiet.I would also take out the dog bed and replace it with a Kong or a nice big chewing bone. Above all I would give this dog more exercise!!! However much she is getting now is not enough. I have three dogs and the goal at the end of the day is that they are flopped asleep on their beds. They wouldn't have the energy to chew their dog beds. HAHA
Good luck.

Offline trubandloki

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Re: Seperation Anxiety
« Reply #18 on: May 26, 2006, 07:32:14 AM »
Above all I would give this dog more exercise!!! However much she is getting now is not enough.

Very good point!!!!

More exercise fixes all kinds of things.

Dogs need to be taken out for walks and runs.  Just letting them out to amuse themself in the back yard is never enough exercise (I know this because I KNOW my dog does not get enough exercise because I do not take her for enough walks).

Offline knuckles

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Re: Seperation Anxiety
« Reply #19 on: May 26, 2006, 09:20:25 AM »
and remember there is more than one kind of exercise.  many dogs need both mental and physical exercise.  For some dogs, just going on a walk gets them their mental exercise too.  but other dogs need alot more mental exercise.  so maybe add some training.  my JRT loves when we do clicker training for new tricks in the evenings. (which reminds me I need to start that again).

Offline ~Lin

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Re: Seperation Anxiety
« Reply #20 on: May 26, 2006, 03:10:15 PM »
There are many thing that I would do like putting the dog in the crate off and on all day while I was home. Going out side with the dog in the crate for different periods of time. Giving the dog praise for being good and quiet and scolding for any whining,chewing, barking.....
The crate needs to be some place that is not a big deal not ...oh my she is leaving me again.Even putting the crate in a different room like the bathroom,bedroom...  so that when you are putting her in it off and on all day long she doesn't see you. She needs to slowly learn to be by herself quietly. I would go in and give her treats at different intervals. Letting her out at different intervals only when she is quiet.I would also take out the dog bed and replace it with a Kong or a nice big chewing bone.

Done it. She is perfectly fine in her crate when I am home, or if I am in the yard. She just seems to know when I leave the property, maybe scent or something. And, she hates Kongs, won't touch them. Even if I stuff them with goodies, she will lick the easiest part she can and then push them away because they bore her. And, I already mentioned, I give her an everlasting treat ball in her crate. She DOES love that, I tested it out once outside the crate before I started giving it to her in the crate. And the crate is in the petroom, so no she doesnt see me when she is in it. Ive had her in it all night before, with no issue as long as I was in the house. And I can be working in the yard for hours and have her in her crate or loose and she is fine. Its only an issue when I leave the property.

Above all I would give this dog more exercise!!! However much she is getting now is not enough. I have three dogs and the goal at the end of the day is that they are flopped asleep on their beds. They wouldn't have the energy to chew their dog beds.


She gets as much exercise as I have time to give her. She gets an hour walk a day, plus play time in the backyard daily, play time with other dogs for hours a couple times a week, plus running around the barn when I go work with my horses. Our city dog park is opening July 1st, when that opens she will go there daily. Thanks for the suggestions though, I appreciate them. Its just I really think I have tried it all. I haven't found something yet that I haven't tried. Maybe going through the different pheremone things. Ive tried calming supplements, but maybe I didnt use the right kind or give them a chance. And, theres really no way to get this dog tired to the point where she wouldnt chew her bed lol, she has endless energy. We have had dog park days once a month to raise money for the dog park opening, and I let her play for hours. At the last one, she played so hard (she pretty much was nonstop running for 5 hours) that she was limping. I dragged her home when I noticed her limping, and still she had more energy and could have kept going.

Offline trubandloki

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Re: Seperation Anxiety/Dog Tearing up crate pads/beds
« Reply #21 on: May 26, 2006, 03:55:32 PM »


You can't diagnosis this or help it over the internet - find a good behaviorist and go from there. I have my doubts that this is SA, but thats for a professional who can see the dog and examine it, to decide.


Since nothing else seems to work for you, ask your vet next time you are there for the name of a good behaviorist and discuss your concerns with your vent and the behaviorist.

Offline myratcookie

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Re: Seperation Anxiety
« Reply #22 on: July 05, 2006, 07:28:47 PM »
I think my dog Patches has the same thing.She doesn't tear things up,but she whines,cries,and scratches on doors and things.She even does it when I'm here,and she can't see me.