Author Topic: Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues  (Read 5880 times)

Offline ZooKeeper83

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Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues
« on: May 03, 2008, 12:43:07 PM »
My boyfriend and I just bought a house a few weeks ago and we're currently having an issue on whether or not to bring his 4-year-old beagle girl, Bailey, with us to our new home.

Howie (my boy) and Bailey have lived with his parents for the past 2-3 years.  His mom really loves Bailey and doesn't want us to take her.  She only works part-time, so she's home a lot with Bailey and their Golden and cat.  We know Bailey likes being in a house where someone is home pretty much all of the time, she's accustomed to living there, and they do love her, so we were originally planning on leaving her even though she still is technically Howie's baby.

There's one big issue, though - Bailey is now grossly obese due to his parents.  His parents really do love her, but they tend to overfeed all their animals with sub-par food (normally Kibbles N' Bits for the dogs, but sometimes 'Whatever's on sale.') and tons of fattening treats (she goes through a box of those Chew-eze things in a week or two).  Bailey should weigh about 25 pounds, but at her last vet visit she came in at 55!!  Once I had been around the family long enough, I kind of butted in and put Bailey on a diet of 1/2 a cup of Canidae per day (I know there could be much better diet foods, but it was just supposed to be a first step to get her on a normal portion of a decent food rather than 3+ cups a day of Kn'B and then go from there).  However, his mom still wanted to be able to feed Bailey and still puts "just a little extra" in her dish.  We also told her NO extra treats at all except for carrots or the occasional diet treats we would buy or make for her.  But his parents continue to go out and buy the cheap fattening treats you can get at the grocery store and hand them out multiple times a day.

I've tried explaining to them that her life will be shorted by years with how overweight she is and how many extra problems she'll most likely end up having (she already gets leg pain if she tries to jump up or down on to couches or beds), but they only look at the price of the food and treats and the fact that as a beagle she's ALWAYS willing to eat whatever they offer.  A few days ago they even admitted to already putting her back on Kn'B right after we left because "They're not spending $30 on a bag of dog food." even though we told them we would continue to purchase her food.

Needless to say, Howie and I have had just about enough.  We don't want to hurt his mom, but we don't want to see Bailey at her current weight.  We feel we've given them every chance to try and make her health better, but they just refuse to listen, so we want to take her with us.  We're just really worried that we'll hurt or alienate his mom - who we're both really close to.

The only option I can think of as a middle ground would be us taking her, but dropping her off with his mom for 'baby sitting' whenever we'll both be working fairly long days (2-3 days a week, because we both work full-time but Howie's shifts change day by day and I have a fairly normal work week).  I see that as being fair, but I'm still worried she'll be hurt by it.  I'm also worried that she'll completely de-rail Bailey's diet each time she goes over.

Any suggestions on how to handle this wonderful situation?  :-\

Thanks so much!
Melissa
« Last Edit: May 15, 2008, 12:09:16 PM by ZooKeeper83 »
Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline critterchic

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Re: Take her or leave her?
« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2008, 06:45:50 PM »
Wow, thats a tough one.  I would of course take poor Bailey out of that situation. Love is a funny thing, people use it in such a caviler way, especially concerning animals.  If Bailey is Howie's dog then his Mom really should just accept the fact that she goes with you both, as for taking her over for babysitting 2-3 times a week, well Mom could put a lot of food into her in that time.  As you know Bailey's life is at risk, there is a show on Animal Planet Saturday nights at 10:00 concerning canine obesity, sit the in-laws down and watch it together, they might get a clue to the damage they are doing in the name of love.  Good luck and congrats on the new house!
"This is the beginning of a new day.You have been given this day to use as you will. What you do today is important because you are exchanging a day of your life for it.When tomorrow comes,this day will be gone forever; in it's place is something that you have left behind, let it be something good."

Offline JR1030

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Re: Take her or leave her?
« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2008, 06:51:29 PM »
Do you have a good vet?  Take Bailey to the vet, and get a report on her weight, and what should be her feeding schedule, etc. including healthy treats.  If you're willing, tell your BF's mom that if she can follow what the vet says, and she starts losing weight and getting healthier, then she can keep her -- if not, you guys will take her for her own sake.  If you don't want to be that hard-ass about it, just tell her you've got a house now, and you really want your dog.
~Rebecca

Offline ZooKeeper83

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Re: Take her or leave her?
« Reply #3 on: May 05, 2008, 02:28:31 PM »
Thanks guys.  I think we are just going to have to tell her that we changed our mind and want her with us because we miss having her around.  We did take her to my vet who agreed with the diet I put Bailey on 100% and actually told me I could feed her less (I think I originally had her at 3/4 cup a day total and she's the one that suggested 1/2 cup instead).  When the information from the vet visit was reiterated to Howie's mom her reply was, "Only that much food!!  She gets next to nothing already!"  At first, though, she did seem to be following the diet.  That was about 5-6 months ago.  Now it's gone straight out the window.  Bailey should have lost at least some weight by now, but I honestly think she's getting even heavier.

They even took their own golden to their vet and were told that she is at least 20 pounds heavier than she should be, too, and she's eating too much.  Other than dropping her food down to 1 1/2-2 cups a day (unless it's gone back up again), nothing else has changed.

I swear I've tried with them, but some people just... :doh:

Critterchic - I actually saw that show a month or so ago.  I think that's what really started worrying Howie.  He used to joke about her weight with the rest of the family (calling her a 'piggle' - beagle/pig mix), but after I started explaining what could go wrong with her, he started understanding the importance of the situation.  Then, after watching that show, he doesn't find her weight amusing in the least anymore.

Thanks again!
Melissa
Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline Ratwings

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Re: Take her or leave her?
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2008, 11:49:24 PM »
Take her! This may sounds callous, but her health is more important than your mom's happiness at this point! She is killing her with love. She can live without her, but she may not last much longer (in a good quality of life) in this condition is she stays with her.

Also has she had a thyroid test done? This can cause excessive weight gain (although it sounds like the food is a major problem here).
~Julie

Offline NutKitty

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Re: Take her or leave her?
« Reply #5 on: May 08, 2008, 09:03:48 AM »
Definitely take her...  or if you do give his mother another chance, give her a trial period.  If that doesn't work - take her.  :/

Offline strangeduck

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Re: Take her or leave her?
« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2008, 06:54:36 PM »
With her weighing over twice the amount that she should, I would just take her and be done with it.  Even if she doesn't show it, every step she takes has got to be painful, her little bones and tendons weren't meant to carry that kind of weight.  The best interests of the dog have to outweigh the desires of your mom.  It's going to take some serious work to get that kind of weight off of her, and it doesn't seem like your mom is ready to do that work. 

When you have her, I recommend you try getting her to do some swimming.  It will be alot easier  on her body than running, so she'll get a more vigorous work out.

And if you have to leave her with your mom, find a way to shock her into seeing the harm she's causing to the dog.  Maybe talk to her about what it would be like if you, her child, weighed more than twice your healthy weight would make her feel, especially if it was because she loaded up your plate and gave you lots of candy.

And since fat animals trigger some stupid switch in my brain that makes me go "Aaaaawww" even at the same time I'm thinking how they desparately need to lose weight you should post some pics.  Then maybe you could post pics of her weight loss as she makes progress.
Owned by 3 dogs, 2 cats, 1 snake and 3 adorable rattie boys!

Offline Heather

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Re: Take her or leave her?
« Reply #7 on: May 09, 2008, 12:23:25 AM »
Amos is a 15" beagle and only weighs 20 lbs. I like him on the small side, usually around 19.5 lbs and I want to see the hourglass shape no problem when I look at him. It makes me absolutely sick to see obese dogs. I cannot tell you how many times I have had Amos in public and heard the phrase "that's the skinniest beagle I've ever seen! Our's weighs (some number over 30 lbs)" I just tell them I don't feed him when he acts hungry, he gets no table scraps, only his raw food and occasionally a Z Ridge carrot bone (once every other month or so and I discontinued canned food once a month as a treat). Amos actually doesn't bother begging anymore because he knows it gets him nowhere.

Please take that poor dog. I agree that her health is WAY more important than your MIL's happiness. I wouldn't ever let that dog around her again either. No babysitting over at her house, no watching her while you're on a weeks vacation, nothing. Harsh, maybe, but what will happen is that Bailey will have lost the weight and she'll go over to MIL's house, MIL will say "oh my god! they're STARVING YOU!!" and proceed to feed her all she can eat all day, possibly resulting in pancreatitis if she's feeding her fatty foods. Some people are just ignorant when it comes to an animal's health and wellbeing, and they, as a result, should not be allowed to have animals. 55 lbs for a beagle is severely life threatening. I would actually get her on a grain free food and eliminate carbs. Carbs will make weight loss harder, despite if you only feed 1/2 c a day. I would get her on EVO, Wellness Core, Natures Variety Raw Instinct of some other similar food.

Offline ZooKeeper83

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Re: Take her or leave her?
« Reply #8 on: May 13, 2008, 10:54:16 AM »
I just wanted to thank everyone again.  I did get some extra ammunition to use when trying to get her to our house.  It might be a bit of a battle for awhile, because it now seems that my other half is chickening out.  I think he's more scared than even he realizes of disappointing his mom.  And, well, I love her, but I'm not.  Oh, I'll get Bailey here, though.  It just might take a little prodding and reminding over and over what could happen.  I especially want to get her over here soon because I should finally be able to switch over to raw within the next few months.  My wildlife rehab director has a deal with a local butcher to get meat in bulk at cost and she plans on then selling a decent amount to me for the same price.  Sooo...I'll be getting a good deal and getting everyone on food that will hopefully fatten up the skinny, problem- ridden basset and thin down the fat beagle.  Oh, the pair we have.  ::)

Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline Heather

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Re: Take her or leave her?
« Reply #9 on: May 13, 2008, 05:41:44 PM »
Wow I'm envious on the meat deal you're getting! I've been trying to get in good with the local butcher here but no luck yet. :( I also ate my words because I took Amos to the vet a few days after I posted and he was a FAT 23.6 lbs. I almost DIED! I weighed him twice just to be sure and yep, 23.6 lbs. My weight loss plan for him is exercise like ball throwing, walking, biking, for 30 mins a day and feeding him only half of what he normally gets. I can see him starting to slim down. Just wanted to throw that out there incase you're not sure how to start up a beagle weight loss program. :)

Offline ZooKeeper83

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Re: Take her or leave her?
« Reply #10 on: May 14, 2008, 07:12:06 PM »
Haha!  I know I was so excited to hear about the deal she was getting.  I probably wouldn't be able to get in good enough with a butcher either, but Donna has her ways (well, and 4 or 5 dogs and two cats all on raw, so she's a pretty steady customer).

And yeah, I figured with Bailey we'd be doing lots of short walks (since her little legs can't take too much at once), just like I do with Dopey (my basset).  Except for him, it's to try and keep his leg muscles in shape since he has horrible joint problems and arthritis.  Thanks though!  :)
Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline Ratwings

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Re: Take her or leave her?
« Reply #11 on: May 14, 2008, 11:43:18 PM »
Does Bailey like to swim? That is great exercise for overweight and/or arthritic dogs. Even better: if you know of any vets with an underwater treadmill I would highly recommend it.
~Julie

Offline ZooKeeper83

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Re: Take her or leave her?
« Reply #12 on: May 15, 2008, 12:05:48 PM »
Well Bailey decided the show everyone that her weight loss can't wait.  Howie's parents just called us TODAY and said thet YESTERDAY Bailey was laying on the couch and simply started having issues breathing.  They said she sounded like she occasionally does when she drinks too fast and water goes down the wrong tube.  Howie's dad didn't know what to do, so he tried blowing in her nose to help her out.

I can honestly say I wouldn't have known what to do either since she wasn't choking on an object, so she would have been rushed to my vet.  If I needed to do quick at home help my best guess would have been using the nebulizer I have on hand for my girls with either water or saline.  Or using an asthma inhaler I bought at CVS to try when my rattie Autumn was having constant breathing problems.   Anyone have any input if this should happen again?

They say she's been breathing fine ever since, but I did call my vet to discuss it with her.  She should be calling me back later today.

Now Howie doesn't want to bring her over because he's worried she'll have another attack at our house when no one is home (someone is currently home at his parent's house 24/7).  I'm really stressing here because I want her at our house, but I can't promise she'll be fine while we're at work (something you can never promise even with a healthy animal, because things can happen).

Of course things can never work right...
Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline JR1030

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Re: Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues
« Reply #13 on: May 15, 2008, 01:16:41 PM »
Please do take her to the vet.  I wish I could say just take her, but you have a good point about the 24/7 supervision.  *sigh*  If you could just be sure that his parents would take the appropriate steps to help her lose weight and be healthy.
~Rebecca

Offline ZooKeeper83

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Re: Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues
« Reply #14 on: May 15, 2008, 03:37:42 PM »
Whoops! Sorry, I forgot to add in there that I did make an appt. for Bailey.  It's just not until Saturday morning at 8:30am.  That's why I at least wanted to discuss things with my vet today.

I'll also be giving the number and directions for a local e-vet where I know one of the vets to howie's parents and telling them i'll pay!  Hopefully, that won't have to happen though.
Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline tsk_n_such

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Re: Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues
« Reply #15 on: May 15, 2008, 11:28:18 PM »
Is it possible that she had a reverse sneezing issue? It does sound like a dog who has something go down the wrong way.  It's common for people not familiar with it to think it's choking or something similar. You should definitely have her checked out just in case, but the fact that it was helped by blowing in the nose  (it will pass on its own, but sometimes if you can interrupt it, you can stop it faster) and didn't repeat itself, as well as her being fine (I assume) afterward makes me suspect that it was a reverse sneeze.
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Offline JR1030

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Re: Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues
« Reply #16 on: May 16, 2008, 10:16:47 AM »
Is it possible that she had a reverse sneezing issue? It does sound like a dog who has something go down the wrong way.  It's common for people not familiar with it to think it's choking or something similar. You should definitely have her checked out just in case, but the fact that it was helped by blowing in the nose  (it will pass on its own, but sometimes if you can interrupt it, you can stop it faster) and didn't repeat itself, as well as her being fine (I assume) afterward makes me suspect that it was a reverse sneeze.

What is reverse sneezing?  I've had dogs that get weird, noisy breathing through their nose, and it last for a minute or less, and then stops.  Is that what it is?  Sorry if this is a hijack.
~Rebecca

Offline ZooKeeper83

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Re: Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues
« Reply #17 on: May 16, 2008, 01:33:25 PM »
Is it possible that she had a reverse sneezing issue? It does sound like a dog who has something go down the wrong way.  It's common for people not familiar with it to think it's choking or something similar. You should definitely have her checked out just in case, but the fact that it was helped by blowing in the nose  (it will pass on its own, but sometimes if you can interrupt it, you can stop it faster) and didn't repeat itself, as well as her being fine (I assume) afterward makes me suspect that it was a reverse sneeze.

What is reverse sneezing?  I've had dogs that get weird, noisy breathing through their nose, and it last for a minute or less, and then stops.  Is that what it is?  Sorry if this is a hijack.

Haha.  Don't worry about the hijack, I was going to ask the same thing myself.  After thinking about it, I've had dogs do that, too.  Where they make noisy breathing thing, too, for a minute and then it's over and done.  When Howie's parents told him about what happened, for some odd reason I was imagining Bailey's choking going on for a lot longer than that since they made such a big deal about it.  I probably should actually ask them how long it went on for, though.  :doh:  She'll still be going to the vet in the morning anyway (and we'll get another weight on her to show his parents how her 'diet' with them has been progressing.  ::))
Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline Heather

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Re: Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues
« Reply #18 on: May 16, 2008, 02:07:22 PM »
Reverse sneezing is VERY common in beags. Not sure why. Mine gets it sometimes too. But still have her checked out to make sure it's nothing serious, especially with her being so obese. My boss's husband had breathing troubles, was overweight and ended up having a heart attack and dying.

Offline Kati33

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Re: Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues
« Reply #19 on: May 20, 2008, 03:35:43 PM »
To further the hijack- here is an awesome example of a reverse sneeze:
NC State Video
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Offline JR1030

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Re: Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues
« Reply #20 on: May 20, 2008, 03:41:21 PM »
To further the hijack- here is an awesome example of a reverse sneeze:
NC State Video

Oh, my gosh!  That's exactly what my last two dogs have done...I had no idea what it was.  I don't remember any of my childhood dogs doing that.
~Rebecca

Offline Ratwings

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Re: Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues
« Reply #21 on: May 20, 2008, 10:38:39 PM »
I hope she was reverse sneezing, and like the others have said, I think she most likely was. Is there some way you can show your parents the You Tube clips and ask them if that is like what Bailey did? Reverse sneezing is pretty scary and seems very serious to the un-initiated. I work at a vet and clients think their dogs or seizuring, choking, or otherwise dying.  Not that they are stupid, but if you don't know any better, it DOES seem really scary. I remember the first time it happened to my dog years ago.  I though he was suffocating or something. Then you can assure them that it is perfectly harmless and she is safe to say with you guys.

But I would still take her to the vet to get her started on her weight loss plan and just to double check about the breathing issues.
~Julie

Offline ZooKeeper83

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Re: Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues
« Reply #22 on: May 21, 2008, 02:08:58 AM »
Yup, my vet agreed that it was most likely a long reverse sneeze.  Ratwings - I'll try to remember to bring a laptop over to their house the next time we visit to show them and double check with them.  The parents said that it went on for over a minute, stopped for a second, and then continued on for another minute or so.  That's why they got worried.  She had done it before, but never for such a long time.  My vet did say that it's possible it went on for such a long time due to her weight.  She just wasn't able to regulate her breathing again as quickly as she should have been able to.

My vet checked her out and she is completely healthy, except for still being so obese.  However, she is now down to 51 pounds.  Not a huge change, but it's at least something.

I was told by my other half that I'm being a little, um..pushy..about getting her to our house lately and this is what he wanted to try one last time:
We took Bailey to our house Thursday afternoon.  Howie said his mom was about to cry when he told her he was bringing her over for at least the night, maybe longer, but they could come see her Friday afternoon and possibly take her back home.  While at our house she cried constantly if he wasn't right near her and even sometimes when he was.  She started to calm down a little overnight, but she would cry if she was left alone for any amount of time.  That worried Howie, but I told him she would need time to adjust.  It's all completely new and scary to her and she's a sensitive dog - of course she'll tell us that she's not sure what's going on right now. 

On Friday afternoon he sat his mom down.  He told her, "You know how much you hated having Bailey away for just last night?  Well, think about what it would be like if that was for the rest of her life.  If she doesn't start losing weight at your house, I will bring her over here so that she can."  and reiterated all the no treats/only 1/2 a cup of the food that we'll decide on rules.  She agreed, and he let them take her back home.  Apparently, their golden was a little 'off' all night with Bailey gone.  Acting withdrawn and such, so they felt extra bad that Bailey wasn't there.

I took her to the vet Saturday morning and then told them what my vet told me (for them, because she knows I already know what to do for her to help Bailey lose weight).  I told them how my vet likes to compare foods like Kn'B to chocolate cake - not exactly something anyone should live on as a standard diet.  I did tell them that she lost a little weight, but she still has so much more to lose and if they hadn't been feeding her extra things, she could have lost even more.  We also agreed to tell them that the reverse sneezing could have possibly taken so long due to her weight and that was just the start of so many problems she could, and most likely would, be having if they didn't help us get her back down to 25 pounds.  Bailey does apparently have a larger beagle stature so 25 pounds should be good for her with 30 being the extreme highest she should ever be to still be healthy. 

My vet was also telling me about a new drug they're trying with overweight dogs that basically is an appetite suppressant.  She said it's pretty much to train the owners to see that dogs that will normally constantly eat (like beagles and other hounds in general) can actually survive on less, because they'll simply stop taking all the extra treats the owners try to feed them.  My vet doesn't really like the idea, but she said the groups using it so far are showing progress and sometimes the owners really do need this in order to see that their dog doesn't need as much food as they previously thought.  I agreed, too, that it shouldn't have to come to using the drug in this case.  I might recommend it to them for their own golden, though, since I have no say on how much they feed her.

Soooo...they have her again for the time being, but they've agreed to follow our rules.  We didn't set a time limit, but I'm going to say I'll have her weighed again in about a month.  If she doesn't show improvement in her weight, I'm going to become 'pushy' again.  Howie made the threat - so he had better follow up. 

One thing I did notice while she was here that might be a problem, though, is the fact that we live in 1/2 of a double with tons of stairs.  His parents house has three levels - a basement, main level, and attic - but Bailey would always stay on the main level.  In our house, though, she was trying to follow us up and down the stairs constantly and even to get outside she has about 6-7 steps to go up and down each time.  She was limping on her front right leg by the time she left here.  Our house would definitely be a good workout for her, but it would be a little hard on her legs until her weight is down a little more and her body gets a little stronger.  I'd probably have to block her off from the upstairs for awhile, but then, of course, she'd start to cry if we went up there and she couldn't follow... :-\

So, fingers crossed that they actually listen to us this time, but Howie is far more optimistic about it than I am.  :-\ 

Thanks again everyone!  And thanks Kati for the video! I didn't even think about checking around online for examples of it.
Owned by: Dopey the basset; Lacey the border mix, Stinky, Lila and Happy the kittehs; Diesel the ball python; Rosie the dumeril's boa; Chili the children's python; Angus the bearded; Petri the leopard gecko; Addy the crested gecko

Offline strangeduck

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Re: Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues
« Reply #23 on: May 21, 2008, 04:12:34 AM »
Ohmigosh...my Cera has done that couple of times...but not since the days when she would eat every toy my daughter left on the ground...I thought she was just trying to throw up and couldn't.  Thanks for this thread, that was helpful.

And about that pill?  I saw an ad for it in a magazine and it made me so sad.  That we as a society would literally "love" our dogs to death.  I am constantly being told that my Cera is too thin...You can't see her ribs or back bone (though you can feel them) and she has a gorgeous svelte silhouette, but people are always asking me why I don't feed her more.   ::)  To which I reply, a) she's actually at a perfect weight according to her vet, and b) she only has three legs and shepherds are notorious for hip problems, why would I risk ruining the legs she has left just to make her look like someone else thinks she needs to look?  Well, and there's the fact that she doesn't eat unless she's hungry.  The only two exceptions to this rule are hotdogs and pigs ears which are rare treats that she gets one of maybe once or twice a month since it's just pure crap...

Sorry for the little mini-rant, but I get so tired of explaining that no, I'm not starving my dog, other people are abusing their dogs by allowing them to be obese.
Owned by 3 dogs, 2 cats, 1 snake and 3 adorable rattie boys!

Offline Heather

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Re: Take her or leave her? Update - Breathing Issues
« Reply #24 on: May 21, 2008, 06:05:42 PM »
And about that pill?  I saw an ad for it in a magazine and it made me so sad.  That we as a society would literally "love" our dogs to death. 


Sorry for the little mini-rant, but I get so tired of explaining that no, I'm not starving my dog, other people are abusing their dogs by allowing them to be obese.

About the pill, I seen it advertised but didn't pay attention. Society is that of which people tend to think their dogs more as children and while that mentality can be a good thing, vigorous exercise is treated almost as abuse and people don't want to exert their dog like that. GASP at the people who actually use their dogs for the purposes they were bred for- hunting, carting, herding, tracking and all of the sports now available like earthdog, agility, rally, backpacking/hiking, biking, etc. Most dogs would not be obese if they were getting exercise and they are not neccessarily being fed too much, they are just not burning off the calories. And god forbid you tell people to feed their dogs less! I deal with this at work alot. People would rather buy the reduced calorie food that is mostly rice or other grains so they can still feed the dog the same amount.

strangeduck- I know how you feel. I posted earlier on this thread about peope are always saying "That's the skinniest beagle I've ever seen!" when they look at my dog. Sometimes it upsets me when they say it in the tone of "that dog must be neglected because my dog is bigger than him and I take really good care of him/her." And yes, some people really do "love" teir dogs to death. It's ALWAYS the animals that suffer.